Canada can no longer be ‘naive’ about the ‘real’ threats it faces: Chief of defence staff

Militaries are supposed to be prepared and ready for anything, but when it comes to the Canadian Armed Forces, even our top brass have said that's not the case. We must do better. Earlier this year, the Minister of National Defense warned the military is in big trouble when it comes to having enough troops. There's more people have left than have have entered. That is, is frankly, it's, it's, it's, it's a death spiral. And on Remembrance Day, our chief of the defense staff was blunt about Canada's readiness to fight a war or defend itself. Mercedes My biggest concern is not being ready, not having the capabilities, the the people, the training, the sustainment, ready to respond to what is really an uncertain future. General Wayne Eyre never expected to be the CDs, but he found himself in that role, appointed in the midst of the sexual misconduct crisis as the government scrambled to find a general officer without skeletons in their closet. He has had to see the military through difficult times, spreading global conflict, a recruitment and retention crisis, a crisis as well in military equipment and some cuts to military spending. Chief of the Defense Staff Wayne Ayre joins us now. General Ayre, great to see you. Well, thanks for having me, Mercedes, and great to see you as well. So yesterday was your 40th anniversary in uniform, an incredible achievement in career. You have watched such transformation in the global security system, in Canada's place in the world, in our armed forces. As you're preparing to leave, I want to ask you about the state of readiness of the Canadian Armed Forces, because when we've chatted in the past, you've talked about your concern that we are not ready for a war. So what is the state of National Defense in this country? And are we prepared for a military conflict? Oh, it's an interesting question because you mentioned 40 years. And as I think about the history of of the military in this country could almost be considered a history in unpreparedness as wars have come and we've had to scramble to to be ready. And arguably we are more ready now than we have been in, in some time, but that's not saying enough. And so as we take a look at the confluence of stressors and the global security environment that we're facing, probably more complex than than we have ever faced as a country, The the confluence of stressors geopolitically with the increasing alignment of Russia, China, North Korea, Iran, the continuing threat of violent extremist organizations, the disinformation that's happening right here in our own society, you know, coupled with climate change, which is driving security concerns around the world. It's it's causing human migration, it's causing conflict, it's causing increased frequency and intensity of natural disasters here at home. It's opening up our own Arctic, which presents security challenges. You know, we see the acceleration of technological change, which is changing the very character of war, how they were fought. And we're seeing that play out in Ukraine as we speak. And then we see what's happening within our societies with our institutions of liberal democracy, journalism included, under under assault, you know, our own institution under assault, the the institution of elections, under assault and increased polarization in our societies. So those four combined presents some, some real challenges to us as a country and in particular the Canadian Forces, because with those challenges, the demand on us is going to go up. And that's why readiness is so important, the ability to respond at speed, at scale for the duration required with the capabilities required. Now we have work to do on all of those. But I'm an optimist, cautiously optimistic right now that we are an institution on the upswing, that all sorts of improvements are being made across, across a wide range of areas. Not fast enough. We need to continue to to emphasize a a sense of urgency and there still remains lots of work to do. When you look at the threats to the Canadian Armed Forces, you mentioned foreign interference, so that's something I've been curious about. Are you concerned about your members being targeted for foreign interference by other countries? We've heard of members of the RCMP, for example, who have been charged that they were being influenced by foreign governments. Obviously the military deals with very sensitive information. Is that a risk that that you're looking at as well? Yes, absolutely. We know we are a target. We know our members have some some coveted information, some skills, experience. And so it's something we have to be very much on the on the lookout for. This is real, the threat is real. And often in Canada we are naive to the the security challenges we face. You know, it's very different when I travel to other parts of the world where the sense of insecurity is visceral. You know, go to, to Eastern Europe, that was recently in Estonia and Latvia and the, the sense of insecurity due in large part to living memory of being occupied. And then seeing the, the vicious war crimes occurring in Ukraine, the, the forced deportation of 10s of thousands of children, the rapes, the, the, the, the killings. They don't want that to happen. And so they have that sense of insecurity. We've been relatively isolated here, thankfully in in this country protected by three oceans and a superpower to the South. Well, security is becoming global. We live in a globally integrated threat environment and we need to be prepared for it. How much faster do we need to move in order to be prepared for it? Well, the marker I put down with the team is the end of this decade, beginning of the next. And the reason I say that is we take a look at at the build up of China's military. We take a look at Russia's ability to reconstitute from the war in from from their brutal war of aggression in Ukraine, You know, both being led by dictators, men of history and destiny as they would see themselves. They're not getting any younger. Risk tolerance is going up. We need to coexist. We need to, as our top national security objective, avoid great power war. That's best done through the ability to collectively deter adventurism, expansionism, imperialism and and so that is the aim point that we are looking at internal to the Canadian Armed Forces. You don't have a successor named yet, despite having mentioned quite publicly that you were planning to retire this summer. It's been months and months and months. You and I were both at the change of command for the Canadian Special Operations Forces and added you talked about some of the consequences of having not named a successor yet. There's actually operational consequences and there's consequences for military families who don't know where they're going to be posted to. Can you elaborate for us on a bit what what the consequences have been of of this slow response to name your successor? Well, there's a process ongoing. Yeah. We're not the only one who've had challenges like this in terms of slowing down in promotions. You know, we saw that in the United States recently, and they they succeeded through it. So, you know, I'm confident that we will be able to, you know, continue to to move forward. You know, this is a manifestation of the unequal dialogue in political military relations, which is is absolutely proper in in a democracy, the military has to be subservient to duly elected civilian officials. What advice are you going to give your successor? I've got I've got almost a full notebook of advice of transition notes that that I've I've written up as as various issues have have come up. But in terms of advice, it's to be open. And, you know, just because one sits in this position doesn't mean one has all of the answers. The situation that we're facing is extremely complex. We have to be open to, to new ideas, new ways of doing business, external, external ideas. We have to be able to reframe what we what we have taken as underlying truths to a, to a situation. I would recommend Adam Grants book Think again about doing just that and continue to learn. Learning does not stop just because you finished your professional military education. Your your professional development continues every day. What do you think the biggest challenge will be for the next chief of the defense staff? The biggest challenge will be to continue to build rebuild readiness at pace to make sure that we've got the the people, the training, the equipment, the sustainment in place to be able to respond at speed, at scale, at duration. And so continuing to to focus on that, you know, getting our numbers back up cautiously optimistic as we've started this, this fiscal year on the recruiting side much better than we have for for many years. So our efforts at reconstitution are starting to bear fruits. We actually grew the armed forces last year after three years of shrinking. In fact, we are doing better than many of our closest allies from that perspective, but still tremendous amount of work to do there. So getting the people up, getting that readiness rebuilt and and continuing to provide options to government as as crises continue to occur, because they will continue to occur in increasing frequency. I have to ask you, with 40 years of experiences, you reflect on your career. What do you believe your biggest success was and what's your biggest regret? So I have had the, the opportunity to be involved in some very interesting experiences, you know, whether it was the Battle of Modac pocket in, in Croatia in 1993, whether it was my time in Korea with the, with the United Nations Command tours in Afghanistan and you know, leading our our largest to date advisory mission with the Afghan National Army. So all of those experiences are, are something I'll be processing in, in retirement and, and thinking about because it has been such a rich, rewarding career. And you know, as I say to, to the next generation and I reflect on, on my career and I see the trajectory that we are on. Despite all of the the challenges that are out there in the security environment. I would do it all over again in a heartbeat. It's an adventure. It's a it's a way of life. It's a, an opportunity to do something bigger and having a transcendent purpose of, of serving your country, having the adventure of going to many different locations around the world and, and being involved in those super interesting activities. And so, yeah, that's, that's what I've taken away and that's what I recommend to the next generation. I know that you refer to yourself, sometimes jokingly, as the accidental CDs. You certainly haven't had an easy tenure, but we'd like to thank you on behalf of the West Block for always coming on the show and speaking so candidly about the situation and behalf of on behalf of Canadians for your incredible service to this country. Well, thank you, Mercedes.